Painters Kelsey Shwetz, Ehren Clodfelter, and Beata Chrzanowska all deal with issues of sexuality and gender through the medium of painting. They’ve combined their forces to form a painter’s collective, simply called “BLONDE.” I met with the three artists at Kelsey’s studio in Chelsea to discuss what they hope to accomplish as a collective.
Interview by: Annie Malamet
Photographs by: Lauren Renner
A: Okay, so my first question for you guys is: How did you meet and decide to form this collective you have?
K: I curated a show, “Girls,” and I basically just collected their work [Ehren and Beata] on the basis of it being really strong. We connected for the first time, visually, when they dropped off their work and then, of course, we had the show. It was wonderful.
E: Love at first sight.
K: Love at first sight, at least aesthetically and conceptually. Our work is very similar, naturally, because the work that I would select for a show would inherently be similar to my aesthetic. Then we just started hanging and we’d go to shows together. And…I just kind of always wanted to be in a painter’s collective.
B: I’ve been thinking about the idea of being part of a group.
K: We all have.
B: So when Kelsey brought it up, I was just like “Oh my god,”
K: Just fuck it, let’s just do it.
B: I was thinking about Andy Warhol and the whole factory they had and how they always made work together.
K: Informed each other’s work…
E: The community, not only related to our work, which initially brought us together, but on a personal level as well.
K: A support system.
E: It’s a rarity to meet two people at the same show, and I not only respect their work and like it and love it, but also like them as individuals, even away from their art, as people. So it was just a really interesting, natural, organic, thing between the three of us.
Kelsey Shwetz
B: I think also the fact that we are all so driven, and that was one of the things that brought us together as well. We’ll say “we’re having a meeting this day” and all of us will just come ready to work. After having a few of these meetings, and a lot of wine…
K: The majority of our decisions are made with wine.
B: That’s the silent member of our collective.
(all laughing)
A: Would you want to add more people, or do you like this the way it is?
K: Originally we were thinking that…at the beginning we thought, ok at first we would start with three and then we would branch out. I just like our dynamic so much.
E: Last night with the Drink & Draw [an event held at Kelsey’s studio where artist’s were invited to come drink and draw a live model], that was an amazing community building thing with artists and friends and people we’ve never met. So in that way, yes we are adding to our collective in a way. But…
B: Well we’re fairly new. And to just start adding a bunch of people to it [the collective]… I think we’re taking it in steps. And right now I feel that things are working out between the three of us. And so because it’s working we can start planning shows, etc. So if there is no need to add on, why do that? But I think in the future, there will just naturally be more people.
E: The three of us are so powerful.
(Kelsey laughs)
E: We are! We’re very powerful and strong people. Put that in print.
(all laughing)
K: We have magic rings.
A: That’s cool you guys are like, real BFFs [Best Friends Forever].
K: We actually are.
E: We’re obsessed with each other.
A: I really like that, I’m into it.
B: We actually each cut a lock of our blonde hair and put it on the candelabra [gestures to candelabra behind her], and we had a ritual.
A: You’re like witches! I’m thinking I’m kind of oblivious because I had this question that was “So why is the name of our collective ‘BLONDE’” and now I’m sitting here realizing all three of you are blonde. But I feel like there are more connotations there…
E: And it’s developing. The name “BLONDE,” the meaning of it is kind of evolving as well.
B: The name is meant to be kind of tongue in cheek. Kind of witty but also edgy. When I think of Blonde, it’s fun. Yeah we’re all blonde, but there’s a humor to it, but also an edginess.
A: I feel like there is a sexuality to it.
K: Yeah!
A: That resonates for me with your work. And femininity.
K: Yes. I like the idea of playing on the idea of…well not “incest,” but just the idea of being brothers and sisters but also having this displaced sexuality, this sexual connotation that all our work has. “Blonde,” like siblings, if one is blonde the other is often also blonde.
E: And it’s one of those words also that [recalls] gender. Of course as artists we break down and everything and analyze it and want it to be perfect. So “BLONDE” initially I think was also [chosen] so we wouldn’t be trying to hard. I’m sure everyone goes to shows and sees paintings and the title or the name of the group, you think just “oh my gosh” (rolls eyes), like really? It can be kind of pretentious. But “BLONDE” is just simple.
B: It is what it is. We’re blondes.
A: You each have very distinct styles of painting that some how work together, which I wrote about when I first met you. But how do feel that these styles relate to each other?
K: I think largely, or course, conceptually. You just cannot ignore that. We are talking about the same things in our work. We’re talking about gender, we’re talking gender norms, sexuality, the expression of femininity or masculinity or androgyny. How we relate to our bodies or the bodies of others. We’re talking about the same things. But we’re carrying it out in three very different ways.
Kelsey Shwetz, “Self-Portrait”
E: Very similar message but very different techniques and styles of painting.
K: Yeah that’s it.
A: Because Kelsey is the most representational. But somehow it all works together.
K: Yeah I think it’s our palates also.
B: I was going to say, color. When you walk in to a our room with all our work…
K: It seems cohesive.
E: Strong color placements. Even Kelsey’s is more representational and realistic, there’s a definite focal point of color. And of course Beata’s tends to be a little more geometric, so there is that strong punch of color. With mine, there is that focal point again of color.
B: I think there is a transition from realistic to more abstract. As a viewer when you come in and look at the work, you get those steps. You’re not overwhelmed because you could just turn around and you could get something a little more simplified and minimal. So I think that’s another reason it just really works. You get your full meal, a balanced meal. You get your veggies, you get your meat, you get your carbs.
A: Beata, every time I talk to you about your work you give a food analogy. I remember when I came to the studio and was first talking to you about your work, you said “I want to feed you, I want to take care of you.”
B: I’m gonna nurture you baby.
A: I feel like, you’re right, it is a progression. Kelsey’s is, not that it isn’t challenging, but it’s the easiest to digest because people have a hard time with abstract work. So it’s kind of like, ok I can digest this. Then with Beata’s it’s like, ok I don’t really see what’s going on but it’s so colorful that I’m drawn to it, I can get behind this. And then with Ehren’s it’s very conceptual, so by the time you get there you’re ready to go into it a little bit. So I think that you did a really good job combining your forces.
K: It was so natural. We didn’t seek it out.
E: And don’t you feel like each of our paintings…like with Kelsey’s work if you really look at it there’s things about her paintings that have such a punch to them. It’s a very subtle punch, it’s not super obvious when you look at it. If you look at this painting she’s working on now [gesture’s to a painting on an easel of two people, nude, engaged in a romantic embrace], it’s a very classically done painting and I think what is so interesting and blows my mind is that it is so classic but at the same time it has that…
B: Oomph!
E: Yeah that’s a good sound effect.
A: Onomatopoeia.
E: Yes, that’s it.
A: Kelsey, what I really like about your work is the relationship between abstraction and realism. In this painting [gestures to painting of a nude woman on a couch], the drapery and the door are simplified and abstracted, but her body is and skin is so realistic.
E: I think a lot of her work comments on contrast, whether it’s gender, good and evil, beautiful and ugly, male or female.
A: You’re all playing with those themes, which I think is what really unifies your work as a collective.
K: I think the most unifying factor is truly conceptually, what we’re making art about. I would say that’s the most unifying factor.
E: And I think what’s so beneficial about our collective is that, technically we’re all very talented and gifted. But I’ve never felt so conceptually strong since meeting them and having these conversations and having them in my life, I feel like the voice behind my work has gotten stronger.
K: It does something to you.
A: Is that what you hope to accomplish as a collective, is to become stronger artists together?
E: Oh yeah. And I think what is so brilliant is there’s no chance of us blending and being too similar.
A: Yeah because you have very different styles.
K: Yeah there’s no competing. I almost feel that maybe you would feel a little bit competitive if you were around work that was so aesthetically similar to yours.
E: But we influence each other. Personally, lately, I’ve kind of avoided museums as much as possible because I feel like I’m at a place with my work where I [don’t want to be] influenced by what I look at normally, which tends to be pure abstractions. But what’s so great if I come to Kelsey’s studio or Beata’s studio, and I see a strong red or a strong blue, if I go home and take that element and put it into my own painting…
B: It’s something completely different.
E: It’s completely different. And I really feel like the three of us, we have things we can almost steal from each other.
K: Yeah that’s it. With no chance of stepping on each other’s toes. Although for me it does something personally when you’re so in awe of someone else’s work, it makes you want to do better work. I’m just really in awe of Beata and Ehren’s work.
E: And how lucky are we to have these people so close to us who are not so above us and so unreachable. You always have these artists,
K: Idols.
E: These idols that you just really look up to. And how lucky are we that we get talk to people we really look up to. One great example is, I was having like…a day. I was having what call “Ehren Days.” So I just call Kelsey like, “can I just come over?”
A: You were going through it.
E: I was going through it. So I came over and just sat on her couch and did not even, we didn’t even really talk, she was just painting. And I was seeing how she was doing her layering and her shading, and blending it away. I took that into my own work when I got home and that’s where that painting [gesture’s to small canvas]…
K: Yeah he presented this gift to me.
E: I felt like it was a good gift to give Kelsey because here I am, I come home…I mean I come over…
K: “Come home?” What a Freudian slip!
E: Right? I was just so lost in a way. And looking at her classical work, I guess I “stole” that and took it home with me, and recreated it in a way.
K: We’re doing inadvertent collaborations.
B: I was going to say that the work that I do, it does have that element of realism and that element of abstraction. So it’s like, if you were to take that and turn it into a metaphor, Ehren is my abstraction, and Kelsey is my realism.
Beata Chrzanowska, “Just Friends”
A: Yeah Beata is kind of the meeting point.
K: Exactly.
B: So it’s nice to just come in and be like, “oh ok where would I abstract with this.” It’s like candy…sorry for the food again. I just look at it [a painting] and I’m like, whoa that was handled so well. I wouldn’t do it that way but I could definitely take that back, take that puzzle piece and translate it into my painting. But [points to Kelsey and Ehren] these are the two ingredients.
A: That’s a beautiful thing that you guys found each other.
B: Ingredients…oh my god I gotta stop.
(all laughing)
A: What about shows. What do you hope to accomplish by exhibiting together?
K: We’ve had one show together, as you know. I can’t help but feel like my work is strengthened when their work is there. And hopefully their work is strengthened when my work is there. I like the idea of people associating our art together and us together.
E: And there’s no comparison, which is such a freeing thing. Because we’re individual artists we have our own desires and goals.
K: We have our own shows, too. We have separate things going on.
E: There’s nothing that could take away.
K: Only to augment.
B: This is the soup bowl.
(all laughing)
B: This is where we come together to marinate our ideas. Ehren has his stuff going on, Kelsey is going to Barcelona she’s going to be doing painting out there. But eventually we’re going to come together once again and share. It’s like we’re hunters and gatherers, and this our home, and whatever bring back we share.
K: Yeah we each do different things and then we can add them together. We put them together, and then you take what you’d like.
E: That’s beautiful. And we call each other out for our bullshit, too.
K: That’s another important thing. If you’re at your own show and you hear people talk about your work…it’s very difficult to get true criticism, constructive or otherwise. It’s also hard to give it. I think people are very sensitive about the things they create. It’s so subjective also and you feel so emotionally tied to it that if someone who you don’t trust makes that criticism, I almost dismiss it. It’s hurtful, and then I discount it like that person doesn’t know what they’re talking about. But when you have these other people that you trust with your emotions…I trust Ehren and Beata with my emotions completely. They can give me criticism and I can give them criticism and we’re just doing it, truly, to help and to give our opinion. I think that is so huge. You get out of art school and you don’t get weekly crits anymore, where do you get that from when you’re out of school? It’s hard to find criticism that’s not from a place of jealousy.
E: Yeah we want each other to be as successful as we want to be successful individually.
K: Yeah that’s it for sure. True support.
E: I originally started out as a portrait painter. I started out doing very realistic work and over the years it just started breaking down. So normally in my living room in my apartment, I have figure paintings of some sort, and they’re still a little quirky. But people like that. And then…I forget what I hung on the wall, it was some pure abstraction. And people said “hmmm, nuh uh. I don’t like that one, can we switch it?” So it’s nice to have someone who understands…and just being around them, like last night at our Drink & Draw, when I was drawing I just felt this power sitting between my two ladies.
K: Yeah we didn’t even mean to do that, last night we were just sitting around in random spots, and we ended up sitting next to each other randomly.
A: That’s really wonderful that you found each other.
K: I always make the joke that we have varying sexual orientations…
B: There’s someone for everyone.
(all laughing)
K: Yeah there is a spectrum of sexuality and we’re on different parts of it. Just like our paintings, we occupy different parts of that. Except sexually, I’d be in the middle, not Beata. So as crazy as it is and as much as you wouldn’t like to admit it, I think sometimes sexual dynamics can really muddy pure connection. None of us are going to run off into a relationship with the other ones, it’s just not going to happen.
B: Wrong pieces, it wouldn’t work out.
K: Yeah that’s it. So there’s none of that…
E: Tension.
K: There is no sexual tension.
E: Just pure love.
K: Yeah that’s it; it’s sometimes so special.
E: Our love for each other is just as pure as our work. It comes from a place of honesty and support and safety.
K: Exactly.
E: We each found safety in our work, and who would have thought we would have found it in other artists. I hate other artists most of the time.
K: I feel like more and more there are less painters. There’s a lot of new media, of course, these great new forms of art. But it just blows my mind that we are painters. I feel like I’ve never had a lot of painter friends.
B: Me neither.
E: Not at all.
B: So essentially there’s a lot we can admire.
K: And we’re so different.
B: Very different, but it’s that topic of sexuality. The fact that we’re all fine artists, our work is very emotional. But there is that distinction that separates us all. But the things that keep us together are very strong.
K: I feel like we each occupy a very original place in each other’s friendships. We each have a separate role, and when we come together we all just fit. It’s just this perfect marriage. A perfect, sexless, marriage.
E: We cuddle a lot.
B: We do.
K: Yeah it’s not like we’re not affectionate.
E: We’re big snugglers.
K: There’s nothing sexual.
B: Which is funny because our work is all about sex. I want to say, I think life is very sexy and I think it’s the sex that’s keeping us together.
A: Emotional sex.
B: Yes. Sex is so important, the emotions that you get. Oh god now I’m getting into it…
E: Here we go!
B: Ok. If you think of an orgasm, the emotions that you’re experiencing, they’re euphoric. We’re all artists, we all love creating work, but when you combine something you love, we all love painting, and you create it on canvas, you’re painting that euphoria. So when I look at Ehren’s work and I look at Kelsey’s work, I see that, the sexuality, it sparks those things for me, that euphoria. I’m not having an orgasm, but I’m getting the same serotonin levels, I get that from their work. It brings me joy. The figure itself, when I look at the figure, its kind of an oxymoron because the nude body…I think of it in terms of innocence. Nudity is so innocent. So when I paint, I paint the nude body because it feels like this blank canvas that I can work with. But the sexuality is that armor. Sexuality comes out as I’m painting. I could accentuate any parts of the body and bring that sex back into this innocent canvas. I’m diverging into this conversation about sexuality, but I think it’s the sexuality that’s one of the main threads that keeps us together. It’s so important to our work and us as artists.
A: I’m glad you mention that because I have a question, because we’ve talked a lot about your work together, but how individually you feel that each of your work addresses gender and sexuality. Do you think that there are common threads among the three of you? If you could each speak to that, and then broadly how that relates to each other.
E: The last thing I ever want to be is any type of painter. Basquiat always hated being considered a “black painter.” But if I were to label myself I’d be more gender based. I don’t think my paintings necessarily address homosexuality as much as gender. Especially recently I’ve been doing more abstracted lumps that still relate to the body, but they do have a level of abstraction. People can still look at them and relate to them, but they don’t necessarily understand. A lot of my work IS gender based and addresses that struggle. There was a piece that was in our “BLONDE” show, it was called “Adaptation,” it was a larger abstraction. [The title] “Adaptation” stuck in my mind because it addressed the process that we all go through. We’ve all gone through many a trial and situations that got us to where we are and developed through our paintings. For me, it was growing up in the south and having that internal conflict. I feel like my work and I are beautiful forms that when you look at them, you can’t understand them completely. I almost feel like I’m painting self-portraits. Even when Kelsey does portraits of friends and other people, there’s still a self-portrait in a way. All three of us, you can see us in our paintings. It might not be a literal representation of us. It shows that process, that change, that adaptation. So that’s where my head has been lately, making more vague forms. Sometimes they’re a little more together and clean and glazed, and other times they are heavily abstracted. I haven’t one hundred percent decided which paintings I’m putting into our next show, but that’s what these girls are for.
Ehren Clodfelter
B: The work that I’m doing, there has always been this fascination with the flesh, with the body. Usually when I paint I don’t [represent] hair because that characterizes the person.
K: Ehren doesn’t include hair either.
E: I never thought about that!
B: I don’t add anything to my painting that would characterize the person too much.
E: As a gender identifier.
B: Hair is so important to how people are perceived. When you take the hair away, you just have people. The only thing that distinguishes male from female is body parts.
A: And not even that.
B: Yeah you’re right. If you just take portraits of people with no hair, sometimes it’s really difficult to distinguish [gender]. Same thing with eyebrows, I try not to include eyebrows. I try to keep it neutral.
A: Hair is a social marker of gender.
B: So I was just really drawn to the body, the blank canvas. So that’s usually how I would start off, and then I would add other elements. Because if you think the body, there is a fragility to the body, the skin itself. So the shapes that I put into the work and the colors that are contained in the shapes, I look at is armor….so I’m taking this pure flesh and giving it that armor and saying to the world, alright, you can approach this, this is safe, this is a safe painting for you. Also on the canvas, I’ll have a lot space, a lot of blank areas, and then more built up areas. I do that because I want it to be a safe experience for the viewer. Like, here’s a spot for you to become fascinated with. This is what I’m fascinated with, and this is where you can go and pick at it and have some fun with this area. But when you need to rest, you have that in the painting as well. Another reason why I love [Ehren and Kelsey’s] work…the work that Ehren does, it doesn’t necessarily mean that you’re the guy I go to when I need a rest, and Kelsey you’re the girl I go to when I want some excitement, but just having those two approaches, it is very comforting to be a in room with artists that have those two elements I incorporate. It’s funny because they’re like my book ends. It also just inspires me to push myself even more. There is realism in my work that I strive for, but I can never go all the way. I just can’t. It’s not in my nature to give everything to the viewer. I want there to be elements that the viewer puzzles together on their own. So I love coming into Kelsey’s studio and being like…DAMN girl. That’s good. That’s my food for thought right there. I can go home and just paint in my studio and feel very satisfied.
K: I think the way I approach work is presenting things that, for some reason, society is just not cool with. The idea of the vagina being exposed in a painting and it’s not a submissive thing and it’s not a sexual thing, and it’s not something that’s for a straight, male sexual pleasure. Even something like female masturbation, or the idea of the male being presented in a submissive pose but with an erection, for people who like to look at hard cocks. There is so much fodder for people who want to look at breasts and vaginas in fine art, in western art. Where are all the hard cocks? Where are the cocks for people who want to look at hard cocks?
E: That’s that punch.
K: Even the idea of physical genitalia being flipped. I think people still have a hard time with transgender people, and what that means and how it’s possible. Menstruation is also huge for me. I have a piece at home, and it’s at home because it’s one of my favorite pieces. It’s a view of knees sitting on the toilet with bloody panties. I painted it in these bright, ice creamy colors, because it’s pretty. I think period blood is beautiful, the colors, texture. I’m trying to present these concepts in a very easily digestible way. Classically painted, so as not to be jarring, because I don’t think these things are, I don’t understand why people think they are. I have tons of radical, awesome queer friends; I don’t need to be making art for them. That’s preaching to the choir. I’m interested in the fifty-year-old white male collector that comes to my studio, I want to open that dialogue to them. People that don’t share my views already. People that think of gender as binary and think of female sexuality as existing only within the male scope. I want to present these ideas that, to me, are just true and they’re facts. But it’s shocking and it makes me sick and angry that a lot of other people don’t feel the same way. So I’m trying to have this dialogue with those people. I feel like it’s kind of an easier thing to do if the work is classically presented. I also like the juxtaposition of it; I think my work is about juxtaposition. I like the idea of a classical aesthetic with very modern ideas. I like teaching things and subverting things. I’m not ignorant to the fact that painting has been historically used to promote religious ideals and ideals of beauty. Oil on canvas has been used to drum into the public’s head what is beautiful, what is divine. I want to divinize period blood. I want to divinize the male erection when it’s not imposing, when it’s for someone else’s pleasure, or female pleasure when it’s not to excite a male, when it’s a private moment. What I really love about their work [Ehren and Beata’s], is they’re doing the same thing, they’re not painting in the same way, but they’re still getting this message across…I like to see how far I can push things technically and draw back and abstract.
I don’t understand the disgust associated with genitalia and menstruation in particular.
E: I think femininity is seen as…a disadvantage.
A: We try to distance ourselves from femininity. Everybody does.
E: I spent so many years of my life trying to be more masculine. It’s a cultural thing for sure. Even in New York, as liberal as the city is. You can be a female, or you can be a feminine male, and still be powerful and strong or be seen as weak.
Ehren Clodfelter, “Adaptation”
K: Or just constantly sexualized.
E: That’s something that the three of us have come together, we’ve all been objectified.
K: In the art world.
E: As accepting and liberal and open as the art world should be.
A: It isn’t really though.
B: We’re trying to push sexuality in a way that’s…
K: Not objectifying, but in a strengthening, consensual, way. Not to objectify the body, but celebrate sexuality.
A: So, tell me about your upcoming show?
K: Well, it’s November 1st. It runs from the 1st to the 15th at Gallery Bar on the Lower East Side. We came up with a name.
E: “Sweet Skin.”
K: We are going to be showing multiple works.
E: I’m thinking four. We were also discussing having some smaller works as well, which came to us last night at the Drink & Draw. We were looking at each other’s drawings last night and how similar they were but also different.
K: We usually have paintings but we’re thinking of also having [works on paper]. Last night we were all sitting next to each other so we were all drawing the same view of the model. And we want to show these works because it illustrates how, we were all using pen and paper, so it’s monochromatic and the same size, and we’re all seeing the same body from the same angle…
A: But it exemplifies each of your styles.
K: It absolutely does.
A: That would be cool to show those.
K: I think that would be really great.
B: I want to say that there’s a lot of anticipation because our work is moving forward. Kelsey is going to be in Barcelona, she hasn’t given any details about what she’s going to be doing there…
K: I have a residency.
B: And Ehren’s work is also moving in a different direction with these amoeba-like shapes. I feel like I’m trying to branch out, you know, polish up what I’m doing, and to push the body into more of a landscape. But I’m really excited about this show, because I’m excited to see how their work [changes].
Be sure to check out BLONDE’s show at Gallery Bar on Orchard Street November 1st.
Kelsey: http://www.kelseyshwetz.com/
Ehren: http://ehrenclodfelter.tumblr.com/
Beata: http://chrzanowska.blogspot.com/
